Unknown Speaker 0:00 Food, food food who doesn't love food? It brings people together. It tastes delicious, and it can teach us about other cultures in a totally accessible way. Especially in Canada, one of the most diverse countries in the world. You can walk down the street and see food from all over the world. In this episode, producers Selina Setrakian and Minh Truong introduce us to the complex flavors of Hakka cuisine, how to cook them, and how they've evolved over time. I don't know about you, but I'm feeling pretty hungry. This is Same Difference. Unknown Speaker 0:42 Hey, mom put down your phone to add in, you can't you have to back me up on this. So usually at home, my dad actually does most of the cooking. It's usually his take on Chinese food, right. But I don't think he's ever really tried to attempt to make haka food. Unknown Speaker 1:05 This is what Hakka means to you. I'm Selina Setrakian. And this episode is part of the podcast, Same Difference, a series about belonging. Unknown Speaker 1:19 So my name is Erin. I am Chinese Filipino Canadian question mark. Unknown Speaker 1:27 Why question? Oh, sorry. This is your intro. Unknown Speaker 1:29 I don't know. Usually when I introduce myself, I just say I'm Chinese, Filipino. I don't usually include the Canadian part. But I guess I'm more Canadian. Unknown Speaker 1:36 This is what a lot of my friends say that they feel more Canadian, that the other parts of their cultural identity feel distant, disconnected and lost. It's been something that always comes up. And I felt it too. But I started wondering, is there an easy way to fix it? Is there a way to bridge that gap and start connecting to that lost part of you? Then I remembered something, or I guess someone, Erin. I remember this one time we were walking and we passed by this building with big letters that read Hakka. I remembered she had told me her mom was Hakka, and I never heard of it before. So I asked her to explain what she knew a mixture of Indian and Chinese cuisine, a food that found itself in a place of in between. I thought, hey, that's like us. It's been influenced and evolved into something more than just one identity. So I called Erin and I asked her if she had made Hakka food before, she had not. And I asked her if she would be willing to participate in an experiment with me an experiment to see if recreating a cultural dish would help you feel closer to your cultural identity. And she said, yes, but we couldn't do it on our own. We needed the person who was responsible for Erin's Hakka roots. Correct. Unknown Speaker 2:51 So I'm Christine Chu. I am Erinn tomorrow's mom. I am a Hakka Chinese born in India. We immigrated to Canada in 1981. I'm married to a Filipino man who was born in Pembroke, Ontario. Unknown Speaker 3:12 I think you guys did a pretty good job in raising us to experience different tastes, and not be afraid to try things. Unknown Speaker 3:18 I try to instill that they not be afraid of any culture or getting to know their different cultures. So starting with that would be from the food and then from interests they, they learn about the stories and things like that. Unknown Speaker 3:32 We're a very mixed bag family, with a lot of, you know, different influences coming in. Unknown Speaker 3:37 Yeah, Ithink that's, that's a key word influences. Unknown Speaker 3:40 Yeah. Also, we're not very picky in terms of eating except mom doesn't like fish that much. Better. I eat sushi. You still can't eat like the most basic fish though. Unknown Speaker 3:50 Yeah, it has to be very frozen and it has to have a lot of wasabi. Unknown Speaker 4:00 The next step was grabbing ingredients. Erin sends me an address, Sonny Food Mart. It's local, so it doesn't take too long to drive over. Inside the market is bustling. The fans are loud and constant, the carts all squeak and there's people in practically every aisle. Cindy Lopper's Time After Time plays over the speakers and we sing along at first, it seems well loved and alive. Erin's forgotten her glasses, so she can't see. But that doesn't stop her. She's been here before and easily moves about. What's more, Erin talks me through the different foods I have no knowledge of and she's clearly excited. That's something I knew I could count on her love for food and sharing it with others. As we move past stacks of fresh green vegetables, she lets me know a little bit about why she chose this place in particular. Unknown Speaker 4:47 It's technically like an Asian food Mart, but the community here is predominantly Indian. And so there's a lot of Hala there's a lot of like cousin food and stuff here. So find you know more of this kind of stuff than you would at like foodie Mart, which is more traditional Chinese stuff.My dad loves it. I would like to get some tender chicken meat. Unknown Speaker 5:14 Why does it have to be tender? Unknown Speaker 5:16 It just tastes better if it's fried. So I was looking at these boneless chicken legs because they're boneless. That means I don't have to deal with bones. And that sounds wonderful. I'm spending a lot today and it's all going to my dad's credit card. I actually don't really remember what else to get. See, this is why I'm a bad shopper. I need chilis. I need to buy chilis. The thing about my mom that Hakkacuisine is that I don't think she actually ate a lot of it when she was a kid. Because she grew up pretty poor. So they ate a lot of poor people meals. She talks about how she grew up on a farm and stuff. I don't really know much about it, though. Unknown Speaker 5:50 No, no, no. In India, we weren't at a farm. We were in a town. Unknown Speaker 5:54 Where did you grow up on a farm? Unknown Speaker 5:55 I didn't grow on a farm. Unknown Speaker 5:56 I thought you were on a farm Unknown Speaker 5:58 In China. Oh, my ancestors were farmers. Unknown Speaker 6:03 I thought you were a farmer. Unknown Speaker 6:05 I wasn't a farmer. I was this is Unknown Speaker 6:11 We were in Puna a which is like a three hour train ride from Bombay, the main city, which is the city, Bombay city. Unknown Speaker 6:23 We start the cooking session. And before I can even hit the record button, the two of them are bantering away. But it's funny, because as we talk, it's clear there's a lot Erin never knew about her mom. After pulling up the recipe for the dish, she's decided on chili chicken and Hakka chow mein. Aaron starts showing off her shopping haul to Christine. And pretty quickly Erin starts questioning the perception ofHakka she has in contrast to her mom. Unknown Speaker 6:48 I also bought these Hakka chow mein noodles, so we can make Unknown Speaker 6:51 a veggie hematoma. And that's where most of the veggies are going to. Oh, see, Unknown Speaker 6:56 I really don't have to tell me. Unknown Speaker 6:57 Yeah, I'm going to try it out. So that's why I'd rather save the walk rather than use it to deep fry Unknown Speaker 7:03 vegetables Unknown Speaker 7:08 isn't really says Hakka noodles on it? I was like, I was a little worried because the recipe online just said chow mein noodles. And I'm like, Oh, no, it's like, I don't know if we'll have like, the right ones. And then I saw the package just Unknown Speaker 7:23 Oh, yeah. Wow. Unknown Speaker 7:26 I'm surprised. Unknown Speaker 7:27 Me too. Maybe they finally respect us. Unknown Speaker 7:31 We respect Yeah, Unknown Speaker 7:32 we're Hakka people. We were very adaptable. Unknown Speaker 7:35 What does that have to do with our sec? Unknown Speaker 7:38 We're nomad. We have to be adaptable in whichever situation we are in. Doesn't mean people like Unknown Speaker 7:47 I won't say they don't like us. A lot of people like Hakka food, and they actually find us more friendly. Unknown Speaker 7:54 Oh really? Because we're adaptable? Unknown Speaker 7:58 But people can also be snobby snob in the Chinese community. Unknown Speaker 8:03 Yeah. Unknown Speaker 8:05 Oh Hakka, compared to say Mandarin or Cantonese. Because they think we're mountain people or village PC. Unknown Speaker 8:13 I told you, they don't accept us. Unknown Speaker 8:15 It's not that they don't accept you. Unknown Speaker 8:16 The perception is people grow with her Unknown Speaker 8:19 ancestral beliefs. So what do you know about Hakka? Unknown Speaker 8:24 What do you tell us? We're nomads, mountain people. Unknown Speaker 8:32 I kind of considered kind of like, we're the losers of China. Unknown Speaker 8:36 That's pretty sad. Unknown Speaker 8:37 Because that's not what we are. Unknown Speaker 8:39 I think it's more so I'm joking about it. Unknown Speaker 8:42 So Hakka was a term given by the people of Canton. And what Hakka actually means is guest. Right, so when we weren't even part of Canton, anything, we were termed guests. So we didn't really belong to that province. You can't really even pinpoint in China, where exactly are all the Hakka people. So it was some times in the 80s, I think, 85 when I went back, I was only 16. But you know, you, you don't speak their national language like say Cantonese or Mandarin, so they couldn't place you a Hakka person. Right? So depends on where you are, and what the people how they react back with you. I can't say it's bad or good or anything. It's just, it's different. So you kind of adapt to each place. Unknown Speaker 9:37 When we started out, we were one of the first three Hakka restaurants to open up at the time, all of the restaurant owners did not want to advertise as Hakka, because nobody knew what it was. And if we were to say, Chinese Indian fusion, it could intimidate some people because people's palates are not as open back then. Unknown Speaker 10:03 Sure enough, what Erin and Christine felt was non exclusive. Hakka food and culture was not always as well known or accessible around Canada as it is today. So it must have been hard to connect to and celebrate that identity when it was limited to a few restaurants. I wanted to know a bit more about how it felt like running a Hakka restaurant in those circumstances. So we reached out and found someone whose family had seen it all. Unknown Speaker 10:27 My name is Jeanette Lu. I am I'm a part of the family that operates and owns giethoorn restaurant Toronto's oldest existing Hakka restaurant in the city, when we started, it was about three restaurants that were serving Hakka food, and we did not want to advertise as Hakka, because nobody knew what it was. Unknown Speaker 10:47 Like if you say 10 years ago, the only Hakka a restaurant you really know is Frederick's, rich, right? Yeah, that that wasn't scrubbed round Rex. It's Unknown Speaker 10:56 better in February. Unknown Speaker 10:57 I went through this so many times the way they call, they pronounced it Frederick's the name. It says Frederick's. There's all there was only one or two Hakka restaurants I would say maybe about 15 to 20 years ago. Toronto's amazing, right? You've got all the little towns, we've taken them to Indian town, where you know, they've learned to eat corn, Unknown Speaker 11:20 Little India, actually, as they call it, the hell is India town. Unknown Speaker 11:24 Well, we don't call it India, hot Little India, we just call it Gerrard Street. Unknown Speaker 11:32 I keep finding that Christina is very eager to share what she knows about Hakka during the cooking process, and I rarely need to ask her a question as she just guides me through it all. She tells me stories about her mom, and about India, and about what counts as Hakka food back in China compared to when they immigrated to India or Canada. Unknown Speaker 11:50 Like I said, we were nomads or Chinese people that have immigrated, and usually it's because like the early 1900s, people had such big families and people were so poor, they couldn't afford to be like in China. So they will look for other places to grow to to try to make money to support the family. Unknown Speaker 12:09 From what I know and I've heard from my parents, Hakka food is very pleasant like because we had to scrounge for different ingredients and different kinds of foods and different kinds of flavours whenever we inhabited different spaces. We, in some way are like the Jewish community in that we did a lot of traveling. So when there was civil unrest in China, our forefathers and our community spread out to different parts of the world. And we went to places like Jamaica, Malaysia, India, where our family is from and when we went to these different places, we adopted their culture, fused it with our own and the interesting thing about Hakka is you're not just getting one sort of flavour, you are getting an amalgamation of different flavours. So our family specifically and in Toronto, specifically, Hakka food is very well known and synonymous with both Indian and Chinese flavours fuse together, but at the same time, you can go to a Hakkarestaurant and they can be serving Jamaican Chinese food, you can go to another Hakka restaurant, and they can be serving Malaysian Chinese food. It is so vastly cultured, that you are getting so many different kinds of flavours. Unknown Speaker 12:35 So I'm making two batches of chicken at the moment, which will be marinated with garlic, ginger soya sauce. And the power thing. Are you eating peppers while you Unknown Speaker 13:51 Yeah. Unknown Speaker 13:53 Food. Unknown Speaker 13:54 Can you feed one to me? Unknown Speaker 13:56 You want a pepper? Unknown Speaker 13:57 Yeah. Unknown Speaker 13:59 You only taste the food for seasoning. Unknown Speaker 14:02 I eat along the way. Ah, thank you. Unknown Speaker 14:06 I started to get curious. Other than what we were doing right now. How would Christina and Aaron been keeping their cultural live? I had to know. Unknown Speaker 14:15 We were never like, elite. We're working people. Unknown Speaker 14:22 So even the food itself it's it's, it's it's what the farmers used to cook. Right? Mainly basic, basic, you know, basic rice basic, like meat would be expensive so you won't find as many meat dishes in the old days. Meat was like was like special for like, you know Chinese New Year or autumn festival only a special occasions where meat comes in and is brought out in the cuisine, right? Mostly it's rice, vegetables, eggs. Unknown Speaker 15:05 So the real Hakka food is actually really simple. simple to make and, and hearty. So a lot of porges like we call it canggih. Right. But that's part of their staple. Sure. Yeah. Unknown Speaker 15:22 So I think when you think about Hakka food, it really is that not necessarily peasant food, but more comfort foods. And when you go to a Hakka restaurant, that's what you're going to get, you're not going to get some sort of fancy meal, you're going to get a damn good meal that tastes good at a good price point. And so if that's peasant food, that's peasant food, but really comfort food. Unknown Speaker 15:47 At home, we didn't speak English, we only spoke Hakka. Yeah, unfortunately, we lose our Hakka. because now not as many of us are speaking Hakka. When my parents left when they were like teenagers, right? Basically, during the Second World War was when my parents actually left China to try to set up things in India trying to discover themselves in India. So what they took with them is what they knew of their language at that time. So when they kind of taught us Hakka., and when I was 16, which was like, in like, 1985, when I went back to China, and I was talking to my cousin's, they said, it's like, talking to someone whose language was frozen in time, because they were saying, you speak so ancient, so when I when I was speaking, I was like, speaking like 1930s 1940s Hakka.. We moved to a different country altogether, right. But our language the way we speak, our even our practices are still frozen in time of when your parents from what they knew at the time. But one of the things also I learned when I was in China was because my sisters and I, we grew up with Indian and Chinese and English, I knew what was English for sure. Right? But yeah, there are some things that I didn't even know. Because we speak we we mix all three, right? So I could say in one sentence, like, I'm going to the bathroom, for instance, I can say I'm going to stay away. To me, it's a perfect sentence. But for someone who's like listening, going, what is going to call his washroom, but to me, I can't even I don't even think that I've switched languages. Unknown Speaker 17:47 Right? It all kind of sits in the same place. Unknown Speaker 17:49 Yeah, it's in the same place. So sometimes we used to speak with Indian words. So when I was actually talking to people in China, there's some words that were Indian I didn't even know is Indian. I always thought it was Hakka.. Like, I would say, Oh, I you know, I like the I like the Kayla. But Kayla is not an Chinese terminal chick. Kayla was an Indian term to say banana. So it's kinda you know, we're kind of like a mixed bunch of people. Right? So Erin's even more mixed up, right? She's, she's Chinese, but she's not true Cantonese or Mandarin. She's Hakka. But she loves Indian food. I would say she's pretty International. Like from food wise, Unknown Speaker 18:36 I sometimes wish I was a little more connected to our culture. Because he should Unknown Speaker 18:41 learn Chinese. Yeah, I Unknown Speaker 18:43 do want to learn Chinese, but I don't want to learn Hakka. Then learn Mandarin? Yeah, I was thinking that. It's because I guess because we were born here. We're actually very, very Canadian, I think. And so I don't feel in touch with either my Filipino side or my Chinese side as much as I can, as well as other some of my other friends do. I sometimes joke saying like, Oh, I'm, you know, I'm half Filipino and half Chinese. So I only get half the benefits from each side. So I feel like there's a certain disconnect somewhere. And I'm not completely understanding or what my cultures kind of give me. You know, there's groups of people with similar nationalities that like to group up, right. So sometimes there's like, kids who are Filipino that like to hang together and kids that are Chinese, I like to hang out together as well. But I never really felt part of any group. And of course, either group is nice, and they always accept me, God when I'm there, and they start talking about things that they relate to I start realizing that I don't understand a lot about what they're talking about. Unknown Speaker 18:49 It's, another example would be like when I first started school, in in Canada, I was really uncomfortable. Why? Because I look Chinese totally look Chinese. You know, flat bridge, nose and everything. But when I spoke, I had an Indian accent. Right? So they really couldn't place me. They couldn't learn how come I don't have like a Chinese accent, but I have an Indian accent. But I'm speaking English, and everything is just like, it's not what their perception is. So I have to adapt. The people around me had to adapt. Yeah, it really depends who's around you and what they're used to. Unknown Speaker 20:34 When you were talking about the Indian accent thing, I remembered something from elementary school. So you know, kids are stupid, and we like to play little playground games and so there was one day where my classmate was trying to do impressions of different accents and stuff. And they're like, Erin, you're Chinese, right? Can you do a Chinese accent, so I tried and they're like, that's not Chinese. That's very Indian. It's because my exposure to the Chinese accent, Chinese accent in air quotes is around my family. And it's all Indian accents, not Chinese. Unknown Speaker 21:04 While back, our parents were a little bit concerned, the baby boomer generation, you know, they've been so in touch with the Hakka. roots. And when we got down to our generation, they were just a little bit afraid that we wouldn't be able to keep the culture going and keep the culture alive. Because we are in Canada, our primary language is English. When you lose touch with your culture in that way, it's a little bit hard. So what we've been trying to do is keep our culture alive through our restaurant. And now from three restaurants you're seeing well over 150 Hakka restaurants in Toronto at last count. Unknown Speaker 21:47 I bring Erin and the children and my husband, we go to my parents graveyard, pretty religiously every year, but try to do it at least twice a year. We do what we have in in the Chinese culture is tea ceremonies, where we pay our respects to our ancestors and to people who've passed away. It's something my parents have taught me and I try to also partly to my children as well. We do that especially near as Chinese New Year time as well as the Moon Festival, which is around September timeframe for so those are the two main times we do we do things as haka ritual wise, so at least they also try to remember who their grandparents are. And to try to remember the, the Chinese side of them. Unknown Speaker 22:49 Honestly, mostly just eat as mentioned earlier, you know, people can get in touch with you know, their upbringings just by food. And honestly, I just attached so most of what my mom said with the visiting her parents I was gonna say graveyard Yeah, but it's on third graveyard, it's, you know, technically speaking, Unknown Speaker 23:15 where they were buried. Unknown Speaker 23:16 I don't know how can you more technical than Unknown Speaker 23:20 I kind of like that. I mean, every so often it's not only our family who goes be sometimes meet up with our cousins and stuff to you know, just meet up and do the to ceremony. We also light incense and we burn gifts and things like that. It's quite nice actually. Unknown Speaker 23:38 There is more dialogue. There is more, I guess, awareness of different kinds of foods. People are more cultured now than they were back then. And you know, with kind of this resurgence and interest in different culinary in different shops. There are so many shows out there that are talking about diverse foods. I think that just the market is now ready for different kinds of foods. Unknown Speaker 24:10 There is no real Hakka. food anymore because it was It is based on a lot of different fusions and influences. Unknown Speaker 24:16 Mm hmm yeah, that's a really good shouldn't be one definition because of the nomadic ways of the Hakka people the food has to evolve with where they've they've traveled to, right so that's actually true. True Hakka is how has it evolved there when we say it's not true hackers because we started with the base right? But as you go to different countries that the change the taste, that's where you if you say the hacker Jamaican Chinese noodles will not taste the same as the Hakka Indian Chinese noodles. There and each area has its own different spices. For example, Jamaica has Scotch bonnet. We don't have Scotch bonnet in India. Right? Unknown Speaker 25:06 So completely different. So Unknown Speaker 25:07 if you use some sort of scotch bonnet spice spices versus India has the red chilies, the taste is completely different, completely. So, so like I said, it's it's, it's how where has it travelled through it from from their background really influenced the actual taste. So when some people say, oh, no, that's not true Hakka food. Well, where did you come from? Did you come from Jamaica? Did you come from Indonesia? Did you come from Singapore? Or even come from Hong Kong? Or you come from India and even in India, there's so many dialects. It depends if you came from Calcutta versus came from Bombay. Because there's different regions in India, right, right south. Yeah, South is stronger in their spice taste. Northern is not as spicy but very clear kind of spices on their side. It's just how they make the spice also. So when you you add the different where you belong, like, say north of India, and the chain is Hakka food. It will taste different from where you come from the south with the haka food. So it really is to do with evolving from where, where you've traveled to, and what is what is your base, Unknown Speaker 26:27 The real Hakka is in our hearts. And the friends we made along the way. Unknown Speaker 26:32 Okay, that's cheesy. Unknown Speaker 26:36 So now my next task. Do you think you can make noodles Unknown Speaker 26:41 Ah, you're making me do the work now. Unknown Speaker 26:43 Okay. Well, I just feel like you're good at mixing things on a wall. What Unknown Speaker 26:46 do you so we Unknown Speaker 26:48 need to your meats? No, it's all gonna be veggies. Unknown Speaker 26:54 I don't know about letting it hang. Let's just Unknown Speaker 26:56 yeah, Unknown Speaker 26:58 it's, it's no, just walk carefully and stop making your squeaking noises Unknown Speaker 27:05 Well, I'm not making any squeaking noises. Unknown Speaker 27:07 Just put it here. Unknown Speaker 27:09 We're also the table. Unknown Speaker 27:11 Eat there. Unknown Speaker 27:15 Dude, dude. Dude, I Unknown Speaker 27:18 don't Unknown Speaker 27:18 see that. Well is like right. At that level. Unknown Speaker 27:24 We just did a dangerous operation. Yeah, Unknown Speaker 27:26 don't do that. Unknown Speaker 27:27 We have more fun, don't Unknown Speaker 27:28 you? Unknown Speaker 27:30 I don't think cooking the meal itself connected me closer to Hakka, because I did make Hakka food, but it was in a very American kitchen, right? Maybe if I had access to more traditional means of creating things I would have felt closer to it. But cooking with my mom who has much more knowledge about it and talking to her while we cooked and talking to you while we cooked definitely gave me a better understanding of what Hakka was. Unknown Speaker 27:58 Um, connecting to Hakka while I guess making the noodles was the closest I felt of what I try to mimic what my mum did. From what I can remember back when I was like, I don't know, young, like, I can't remember mom's cooking as much after coming to Canada, but I, I remember certain things that she did when we were back in India, which he she cooked in a wok. And we're Erin's, like just grab the tongs and mix. Unknown Speaker 28:33 Oh no, it's stuck. Unknown Speaker 28:36 Here's the chopstick don't use your finger. Of course I won't use my finger. I don't Unknown Speaker 28:41 know. You might want to Unknown Speaker 28:45 It's stuck. Unknown Speaker 28:45 your songs actually. How can you call yourself Chinese? Unknown Speaker 28:51 fireman's chopsticks guide? Unknown Speaker 28:57 Chopsticks Unknown Speaker 28:58 ASMR Unknown Speaker 29:02 Oh, they're very stuck. Unknown Speaker 29:05 Let me help you Unknown Speaker 29:09 know, they're very stuck Unknown Speaker 29:13 Got what? Unknown Speaker 29:16 Yeah. Unknown Speaker 29:19 Well, are you sure you don't want to screw up on Unknown Speaker 29:23 Chinese? Unknown Speaker 29:24 I know we're Chinese but tongs might be easier. Unknown Speaker 29:28 The decision is chopsticks Unknown Speaker 29:29 I'm half Chinese. I can use tongs. Unknown Speaker 29:33 Up to you. Unknown Speaker 29:36 I'm like, no. I'm going to mix it the way my mom used to do it, which is just get the chopsticks out and you hold the two sets of chopsticks on each hand and you're like, lifting the noodles to mix with the other ingredients. It's just like certain techniques you do. It kind of reminds you of this is how my mom taught me. And my mom to me was totally Hakka. Right. So certain things even though it probably doesn't make sense to Erin like, why don't you just use the tongs? It's, it's more like, I'm trying to do it the way my mom did it. Because I'm trying to bring back my my memories of my mom and what Hakka meant to her. How she was taught to do things in Hakka style. I try to mimic it as well like cooking in the wok, cook lifting the noodles with the chopsticks. You know, when you say you go to a restaurant, you try something and you always say this. It's good, but it's not your mom's right. So Hakka's very personal. Yeah. If it doesn't taste like your own mom's you tend to be a little bit more judgmental. So when you say is this really Hakka food? It really depends on what you grew up and the tastes that you grew up with. Unknown Speaker 31:03 Iit's what Hakka means to you. I think that's what we've learned. Unknown Speaker 31:07 Yeah, it's very person potential title. Unknown Speaker 31:12 I think that's a good way to put it. And maybe because most of my exposure to Hakkafood is you know, just through your family and through the takeout that we order Unknown Speaker 31:20 Yeah. And you will evolve it doesn't matter what generation you are, it will always evolve right? Unknown Speaker 31:27 wonder if it's too spicy. I haven't even tried it Unknown Speaker 31:32 this is done Unknown Speaker 31:34 Wow, it looks like chili chicken and e made it ourselves. Unknown Speaker 31:38 Wow, I'm so proud of us. Unknown Speaker 31:53 so i think you know, trying to make it was different and it kind of inspired me to try it again. Unknown Speaker 32:00 Really? Unknown Speaker 32:00 Yeah, I think so. Because we do make Chinese food but it's not usually Hakka food here Unknown Speaker 32:06 is that because when I cooked it with a real Hakka foods you guys told like the preserve vegetable. You guys like the the the what do you call it the more generic kind of Chinese foods, but are maybe not as Hakka. Unknown Speaker 32:24 Like, then sounds like next time we have to make more of the preserve things doesn't fit. But I think it was interesting to try to make the the Hakka food that we usually get takeout for the Hakka place that's just around the corner. Unknown Speaker 32:37 Yeah, maybe we should try those bitter melons. Unknown Speaker 32:39 Oh, no, I don't like bitter melon. I don't like bitter melon at all. Unknown Speaker 32:43 It's one of those things where like, you're not expecting to come out of this being like a stellar chef and necessarily like, being completely transformed. Like, I love this thing now and I eat every version of it. I think we're like, Unknown Speaker 32:56 Buddha moment. Yes. I finally seen the light by making chili chicken and Hakka chow mein. Unknown Speaker 33:02 I think it's more like you've opened a door that you were a little bit more hesitant to kind of approach before you know, Oh, definitely. She'd Unknown Speaker 33:11 Oh definitely. She'd never cooked Hakka food before. Unknown Speaker 33:14 She always liked to cook Japanese food. She Unknown Speaker 33:18 I don't even do that. Unknown Speaker 33:24 Time to eat dinner. Unknown Speaker 33:25 We finally finished cooking, Erin began taking close up photographs to commemorate the event. Looking closely, one big bowl held in yellow noodles tossed with cook veggies bright orange carrots, green bell peppers all chopped finely, another bowl was full of chicken covered and enough sauce that it was glossy, the kitchen light bouncing off it. It was an image that would make anyone's mouth water. Erin set aside some for me to try and the crunch of the vegetables combined with the soft noodles and the juicy meat made for an incredible meal with an amazing smell. It was a shame that I hadn't eaten that much Hakka before. But with this finished in mind, it was time for the results. Had preparing this help Erin feel more connected to her Hakka roots. Unknown Speaker 34:26 Did you even try that? Unknown Speaker 34:29 Just like one single. Unknown Speaker 34:32 Do you think seeing other people confident about their cultures helped you as well? Unknown Speaker 34:36 Yeah, I think so. I think I think if you're you're you're you put yourself in an environment. You know, you have a choice. You have you can have a choice where you're pegged into a Chinese group or Filipino group or whatever. You still have a choice to even find other people that are similar nature to you where you're all learning about each other, I think that's the most. That's the best group to be in, where people kind of accept who you are. You feel like you don't need to be ashamed of not being fully Chinese or fully Filipino. You're amongst group who is willing to learn about you and grow with you. Now, that's a hard find. But if you find it, hold on to it. Unknown Speaker 36:31 Let's eat. Thank you to Selina Setrakian and Minh Truong for making me hungry. And thanks to our executive producer Emily Morantz, associate producer Manuela Vega artwork by Ben Shelley theme music composed by John Powers. I'm your host, Gracie Brison. And of course, shout out to Amanda Cupido, Gordon Ramsay but nice. And remember fitting in is overrated.